Is it possible to add a turbo to a car that is already supercharged. I have a 2005 cobalt SS supercharged.

Anythings possible. I've seen a supercharger/turbo WRX. (at least the pictures). It would be a great idea on those cars with AWD. Supercharger to beast it off the line and a big turbo for top end. Not sure all the stuff that would be entailed in doing something like that, but I don't see it bieng super difficult, just a couple of custom fabbed charge pipes or something probably.

check out ZZP and their twin charge kit.

you have to drive to michigan for the installation though.

check out ZZP and their twin charge kit.

you have to drive to michigan for the installation though.
Do you know what work must be done to add the turbo.

The theory is that the sc will give you instant boost off the line and then the power will transfer over to a turbo that will give you power higher in your powerband. Unless you are doing an all-show car, do not twin charge, especially from zzp. You can make the same numbers those faggots made with just a single turbo.

You can twin charge as it is called...

Or another option is to get the Hahn conversion kit and go turbo :) (Check out the Hahn level 5 kit...)

The theory is that the sc will give you instant boost off the line and then the power will transfer over to a turbo that will give you power higher in your powerband. Unless you are doing an all-show car, do not twin charge, especially from zzp. You can make the same numbers those faggots made with just a single turbo.

Well I agree with you that the same power could be made with just a single turbo, I think the S/C turbo combo would be more fun, especially for a higher horsepower street car (big turbo). For drag racing, I don't think it would make to much of a differance as you could launch near your powerband or use some sort of anti lag or something.

Iam not 100% sure but isnt there a cobalt that is twin charged and pushing over 650hp?

Not quite that high...

its just under 500.

But the reason for that is just teh size of the turbo its using...

the s/c stops working after about 1 second.. seriously...

the turbo takes over and makes the hard core power... You can use the turbo they are using without the supercharger, but you wouldnt spool till you got pretty high in the rpm band. The s/c helps the turbo spool till it can take over.

still 500+ hp? hate to pull up to that thing at a red light!! : (

Lol.. hell yea man... that would just be a ball breaker.

well thats like a cobalt killing a GTO. That guy was pissed. After i passed him, he was just shaking his head. I mean lets look at it: a GTO has a 5.7 400+ hp and a coblat SS had a 2.0 260+hp, i really didnt think i was going to beat him that bad. But it was still a good race.

Our cars are VERY underestimated.

Just like you underestimated what the power band of the S/C was on the Balts. The supercharger keeps spooling until about 4500 RPM. Look it up and you will see that is where the powerband is. The turbo at earliest kicks in at 3000 RPM.

You don't even know shit about your own car.... :rolleyes:

^^^ i have full 15 pounds of boost by 3300 rpm.

Each turbo is different. The supercharger does make linear power. And actually, the s/c will increase in boost per increased rpm.

And im not sure why you brought up that a SC keeps on spooling till 4.5k? Im not sure what you were trying to get at?

Someone is living in denial.

Btw, why does your sc quit boosting at 4500?

Just like you underestimated what the power band of the S/C was on the Balts. The supercharger keeps spooling until about 4500 RPM. Look it up and you will see that is where the powerband is. The turbo at earliest kicks in at 3000 RPM.

You don't even know shit about your own car.... :rolleyes:

By "spooling", do you mean "boosting" or just the gears turning? My understanding is that the gears in the SC are turning directly proportional to the pulley that is constantly turning with the engine as its running.

I continue to boost all the way up until almost 7k before the needle stops moving. At 4500 i am at about 12 psi

By "spooling", do you mean "boosting" or just the gears turning? My understanding is that the gears in the SC are turning directly proportional to the pulley that is constantly turning with the engine as its running.

I continue to boost all the way up until almost 7k before the needle stops moving. At 4500 i am at about 12 psi

Correct.

If your sc stops making boost at 4.5k you may need to look into that.

It doesn't quit at 4500. I meant to say that the power band of the S/C peaks at 4500 stock.

By 4500rpm, I am at 12 psi as well. At 7k, 16 psi. So the Turbo in 'shortstack' is useless because it doesn't boost until probably 3k and last till 6k. How will that be so 'fast'? If he boosts 15 psi late and short while I am boosting 16psi the whole time till 7k.

Tsk, tsk.

I am not sure what you are talking about

When i am at 3300 rpm, i am at FULL BOOST.. i am NOT STARTING to boost.

My rev limit is 7250.

Holy shit!

He is over 300whp. Hell blow your doors off shifting at 4500

And what RPM does it die?? I can guarantee that it does not last till your redline....

That is what you don't get. A S/C has a constant pull of PSI and no lag with no loss in power due to back pressure, while a turbo is only short burst of boost. Unless you are lying about your set-up, you don't know shit about your car and making a fool of yourself the more you post. You were better quiet like a little bitch. :)

^^ sseigay is?

No I was talking about you blowing off bois doors.

boi, go educate yourself on turbos and report back with findings.

You are a little kid.

If you want to go that way: My dick is bigger so be careful before I slap you with it. (wait, maybe you will like it....).

No I was talking about you blowing off bois doors.

boi, go educate yourself on turbos and report back with findings.

No need to. I know more there is to know about turbos that you and 'training at a gym'.

Its kinda weird having a middle aged man talking about the size of his junk. I blame it on bad parenting.

Umm.. what?

Short burst of boost? Depending on the size of the turbo. yes. If i was running a very small turbo, i would have no lag, and start to fall off in high rpm. considering i know what im doing, a larger turbo, which flows a higher CFM (do you know what that stands for without looking it up?) will in turn, might take longer to spool, but will make higher power, and can in fact keep making power up to a certain point.

If YOU knew what you talking about, youd know that a supercharger does not work off of backpressure. Velocity is the term you are looking for. Backpressure is a restriction of air, when air stops moving, thats bad. Your engine is a pump, the faster the air can be pushed out, the faster the air can be sucked in, thus making power.

you're the one mis-informed, sir.

No need to. I know more there is to know about turbos that you and 'training at a gym'.

youre right. From reading your posts, you seem to know how a turbo works.



syke. :eek:

Also, do you know what a compression map is? Probably not... And by what you have stated so far about turbos, it seems you may not know as much as you think you do.

Each and every turbo has one. You can read these to see at what points the turbo will make its most power. Not every turbo stops making power past 6k. My turbo is actually good up to 500hp.

So you are saying that you can't beat me with the turbo you have right now?? And a bigger turbo would be my match??

You are done kid. Give up.

You are all over and don't know how to read. I already knew that Superchargers were unaffected by backpressure. That is why I mentioned it. You are Turbo and ARE affected. So therefore, need a lot more money and tuning than me to get to your desired power. The more power you add, the more unsafe for your block it becomes.

I have had turbo cars in the past and hate working on them due to the difficulty in tuning compared to the S/C.

Umm.. what?

Short burst of boost? Depending on the size of the turbo. yes. If i was running a very small turbo, i would have no lag, and start to fall off in high rpm. considering i know what im doing, a larger turbo, which flows a higher CFM (do you know what that stands for without looking it up?) will in turn, might take longer to spool, but will make higher power, and can in fact keep making power up to a certain point.

If YOU knew what you talking about, youd know that a supercharger does not work off of backpressure. Velocity is the term you are looking for. Backpressure is a restriction of air, when air stops moving, thats bad. Your engine is a pump, the faster the air can be pushed out, the faster the air can be sucked in, thus making power.

you're the one mis-informed, sir.

Read Bold.

If you know the inducer and exducer wheel size, you can find the size exhaust you need.

I will WALK ALL OVER your car with the turbo i have on it now.

Sure you will.

No proof=no credibility.

For all you say, it could be your cobalt from NFS. I'm talking real cars kid.

Lol. It is not...

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3310148

Real car buddy.

You couldn't have looked more like an idiot than I had imagined. But you do.

You still have a slowbalt. No way you are faster that me. You= 15 psi of 2500 rpm only. Me= 16 psi of 4000 rpm? Me, lighter car due to gutting and better traction.... You are not faster. Sorry but get a life.

You have no numbers so WTF do you think that I am going to believe?? Plus, that is puney psi numbers you put due to the fact that the New SS/TC puts down 22psi of boost and guys get 13.5s. And you claim to run the same with only 15psi??

I call BS!

http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gif

Umm.. stock TCS do not run 22 pounds of boost..

If you knew the dynamics of forced induction, you would know that a supercharger at 15psi is 100% different than a turbo at 15psi.

due to the fact that the New SS/TC puts down 22psi of boost and guys get 13.5s. And you claim to run the same with only 15psi??


If you understood what i was trying to tell you... The turbo on the new TCs is tiny. Thats why it moves roughly the same amount of air with more psi. It has to work harder to achieve the same output..

http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gif

I still call it unless you post times. You are not faster than me. Sorry.

My car isn't GOD but it is still pretty quick for the little money I put in it. Your car isn't ever going to beat mine and I do know that 15psi on Turbos and 15psi on S/C is different but you still haven't answered my question.

What RPM does your Turbo drop PSI? I know it has to be before 5000 rpm. That means after 5k, it sits on its face. My S/C still pulls after 6k. All the way up to 7. The bigger the turbo, the more lag and the faster the psi cut-off.

You lose at life kid. Your car is not fast.

http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gif

I still call it unless you post times. You are not faster than me. Sorry.

My car isn't GOD but it is still pretty quick for the little money I put in it. Your car isn't ever going to beat mine and I do know that 15psi on Turbos and 15psi on S/C is different but you still haven't answered my question.

What RPM does your Turbo drop PSI? I know it has to be before 5000 rpm. That means after 5k, it sits on its face. My S/C still pulls after 6k. All the way up to 7. The bigger the turbo, the more lag and the faster the psi cut-off.

You lose at life kid. Your car is not fast.

What are you talking about? I do no lose any boost... Actually, i have boost creep since im just internally wastegated... i end up at 16.5ish at the end of the rpm band...

If you know what to look for, you will not drop in PSI. The drop would be due to the turbo not being efficient enough at a high flow rate... meaning you cant cram as much air down as you can thats leaving.

I do not have this problem.

And yes... it is fast...

Faster than your under 300hp cobalt.

What are you talking about? I do no lose any boost... Actually, i have boost creep since im just internally wastegated... i end up at 16.5ish at the end of the rpm band...

If you know what to look for, you will not drop in PSI. The drop would be due to the turbo not being efficient enough at a high flow rate... meaning you cant cram as much air down as you can thats leaving.

I do not have this problem.

Sure.... That is why i call BS.

Why don't you do some research and come up with some numbers so that way you can prove EVERYONE wrong.... (like that will ever happen).:rolleyes:

http://www.imagesharing.net/images/bnice01/td06h20gcfme.png

If you know how to read that, youd see at a pressure ratio of 2 (im sure you dont know what that is, nor how to find it) at highest i am running 640cfm.

http://s115271005.onlinehome.us/images/M62flow.gif

If you knew how to read that, you would be able to see at its highest point your supercharger is only capable of flowing roughly 450cfm.

Last i checked, 640 > 450. There are my numbers.

Nice use of Copy and Paste.

Still no numbers of your 'fast' cobalt. This is not the numbers that I was talking about.

lmfao.

go kill yourself.

I copy and pasted the picture links..

Your post furthers my PROOF that you do not know anything about turbos.

I don't see how.


You posting up charts about the CFM ratio of turbos instead of actual dyno numbers and track times further proves that you are a liar and have no 'fast' car.

BS On ShortStack....

Okay... if you want to try and say your faster, what ever..

but wtf kind of argument is saying that i actually dont have a car?

Not everyone lies... im sorry daddy never came back from the milk store with presents...

It doesn't quit at 4500. I meant to say that the power band of the S/C peaks at 4500 stock.

Tsk, tsk.

The power band of the SC peaks at 4500rpm? Have you seen a dyno sheet of a stock SS/SC? They make peak HP around 65-6700 . There is alot of bad info in your post's , yet your the one calling people out on their info? lol

sseiboi: STFU and GTFO. You post a ton of erroneous information and are always putting others down by being cocky

So much mis-information...... I've seen the twincharge kit in person from a shop which will remain nameless as I agreed to not mention them directly....

The way it is set up is a joke, IMO. If the blower is at a constant compression ration, say the stock 3.4" pulley (12psi) is a 1.6 ratio. You have a small turbo making 10psi. Push that 10psi into the 1.6 compression, you get 10*1.6+12= 28psi. Why not have a small turbo that spools uber fast push 8-10 psi into the stock blower? No, the above mentioned "production" kit vents psi to "disable" the blower. It's a weird, overly-complicated kit. Note: above mathmatical ratio and equation is just random numbers at the moment to show how a twincharged setup would work. If you want the TRUE ratio of the m62 on a certain pulley size, PM me. I only used 1.6 as a number to use, nothing more

OP, make your own kit w/ a small turbo and use the stock pulley.

BTW, NO supercharged cobalt, either solo blower or twincharged is documented making more than 450hp.

PM me w/ questions

Lol.. Man i love messing with that kid...

He's a tool.

sseiboi: The blower'd cars may feel like they pull all the way to 7k, but if you look at a dyno graph, any cobalt ss/sc dyno graph, the trq starts dropping off above 5k. The only thing that still climbs is the hp. Only way around that is cams or a swap of f/i.

OK so what is the point that you are trying to prove??

He still has no numbers so just because he has a picture of a turbo means nothing and you are a fool to just guestimate on his hp....

And lastly, I am cocky because this site is always full of incorrect information due to infestation by little kids with little or no knowledge about cars. I like to see if anyone is paying attention but I see a lot of BS go around and that is where I come in to call it out.

If you got a problem with that, then go suck your mom's nipple for comfort because I will just see you as another little kid.

"I was just making sure you were paying attention." -sseiboi

^^ Lol....

So now hes ignoring the fact that other people know i put that turbo on my car...

YOU SIR, are full of mis information..

Also, did you even bother to look through the thread i linked you to?

You couldn't have looked more like an idiot than I had imagined. But you do.

You still have a slowbalt. No way you are faster that me. You= 15 psi of 2500 rpm only. Me= 16 psi of 4000 rpm? Me, lighter car due to gutting and better traction.... You are not faster. Sorry but get a life.

You have no numbers so WTF do you think that I am going to believe?? Plus, that is puney psi numbers you put due to the fact that the New SS/TC puts down 22psi of boost and guys get 13.5s. And you claim to run the same with only 15psi??

I call BS!

http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gifhttp://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp224/sseiboi/BSflag.gif

you really need a better understanding of how turbo's work . 15 psi on a 20 g turbo is turbo is not like 15 psi on your sc .

^^^Not even close...

Its the people who do think that also act like sseiboi... and think they know everything.

^^^Not even close...

Its the people who do think that also act like sseiboi... and think they know everything.

well i been reading what this idiot ( ss boi )has been writing . so have you thought about going any bigger of a turbo ? what is the bottom end on a cobalt ss good till ?
i know i drive jus a neon but heres my mod list if your interested :

50 trim , 750 injectors ,hot sided pipe , cca bfmic, needswings dp no cat, mccord electric opener , agp wga ,dtec fc/bc 23 lbs of boost , front an rear strut bars ,progress front an rear sway bars, tripple pillar pod with auto meter volt an oil pressure guage , turbo xs widebind, turbonetics cold side pipe raptor bov , aem cai,return line with 1-1 regulator ,255 walboro fuel pump ,Centerforce clutch, scan gauge , mpx 62 mm throttle body an ported mani, urathane motor mounts ...

Thats sweet man... Im looking into the bigger TB as well...

I just ordered a manual boost controller :)... 22psi here i come.. lol...

There are a few running over 400hp, and have been doing so for some time now.. with no problems..

And they are daily drivers.

Do you know what your HP is approximately?

Do you know what your HP is approximately?

yeah i'm somewheres between 370-400 whp on a half ass shitty street tune . i jus put the 50 trim on in march an i haven't had to many nice days to tune it . i do need a meth kit because i'm getting 5-7 kr on the scan guage up past 5500 rpm's . my a/f's range from 10.1-11.8 on 23 psi of boost . car ought to be good for at least 12's on slicks .

Yea.. that will be nice..

Meth is a god send.. i cant wait to throw it in my setup... What mixture will you be running? Do you know your timing?

I really wanna throw a 60-1 or a gt35r... something nice and big :)

Yea.. that will be nice..

Meth is a god send.. i cant wait to throw it in my setup... What mixture will you be running? Do you know your timing?

I really wanna throw a 60-1 or a gt35r... something nice and big :)

i'm gonna start with a 60 - 40 mix of meth an my timing is 24-26*. i've got the aeroforce scan gauge that plugs into the obd2 . so i can monitor anything the ecu see's . it's a pretty nice gauge , they might make one for the cobalt .

they do.. they have a cobalt SS edition one that pops up with SS on the boot up screen.

just for your info... 75/25 will work a little better. :)

they do.. they have a cobalt SS edition one that pops up with SS on the boot up screen.

just for your info... 75/25 will work a little better. :)

i highly recomend the scan gauge , what wideband are you using . i'm gonna start with the 60-40 mix cause i am running 93 pump here on the east coast . but if that don't work then i'll up it alittle . i still need to cut the balance chain off during my next oil change . they say anything over 400 whp an your playing with fire if you don't . but once thats gone i'd like to up the boost to maybe 25-26 psi that should put me mid 400's , the bottom end on these are good to about 500 whp so i'm told . we'll see .lol

lol.. what part of the east coast? Same here..

The thing is.. the less water, the better... To an extent...

Take that thing to 500hp and run with it! lol.

lol.. what part of the east coast? Same here..

The thing is.. the less water, the better... To an extent...

Take that thing to 500hp and run with it! lol.

i live in northern va. 500whp lmfao , actually the plan was to build the bottom end this coming winter to hold a 100 shot on top of a maxed out 50 trim . plus add a dcr head an some cams the problem is i got layed off april 3erd ( after 12.5 years ) . so i need to find a good job to make that plan happen . but hey you never know .

Wow, so much BS in one thread. (sseiboi). I have never seen a person so un knowlegeable pretend to know so much! I was going through reading all the posts so I can could call him out on things, but it looks like everyones already done a good job at it and said what I was going to say so.... I guess I'll go drink a coke.

Also, SSEIBOI, speaking about proof, didn't you have some videos of you racing that you were going to put up as proof for gtoguy? I think I looked through that thread the other day but didn't see any videos. Don't ask others for proof if you don't have shit for proof yourself.

sseiboi: STFU and GTFO. You post a ton of erroneous information and are always putting others down by being cocky

So much mis-information...... I've seen the twincharge kit in person from a shop which will remain nameless as I agreed to not mention them directly....

The way it is set up is a joke, IMO. If the blower is at a constant compression ration, say the stock 3.4" pulley (12psi) is a 1.6 ratio. You have a small turbo making 10psi. Push that 10psi into the 1.6 compression, you get 10*1.6+12= 28psi. Why not have a small turbo that spools uber fast push 8-10 psi into the stock blower? No, the above mentioned "production" kit vents psi to "disable" the blower. It's a weird, overly-complicated kit. Note: above mathmatical ratio and equation is just random numbers at the moment to show how a twincharged setup would work. If you want the TRUE ratio of the m62 on a certain pulley size, PM me. I only used 1.6 as a number to use, nothing more

OP, make your own kit w/ a small turbo and use the stock pulley.

BTW, NO supercharged cobalt, either solo blower or twincharged is documented making more than 450hp.

PM me w/ questions

Yes, but parts will have to be changed to not risk brakeing anything.

Yes, but parts will have to be changed to not risk brakeing anything.

What parts are you thinking of? If tuned properly, turbo swapped cobalts are holding 400hp on stock internals. It's always good to upgrade some of the not so desireable parts. The thing is, some people blow up a stock car. It doesn't matter what parts, if you are improperly tuned or beating it to hell, it will let go.

For the twincharge setup, staying at or under 24psi shouldn't be a problem on a stock motor and you could see 400hp. Clutch will go on ya.

Thanks for the info. It helped alot. but just so I understand correctly if we were to do this you would recomend upgrading the clutch kit to at least stage two if not stage three.

Its recommended you upgrade the clutch kit no matter what. Stock clutches on these really SUCK

My clutch is just starting to show signs of wear at 58.8k miles and various power levels from stock to 340

hey freaky, I live in northern VA, which part are you in?

hey freaky, I live in northern VA, which part are you in?

i live in stephens city , it's about 10 miles south of winchester . where are you at ?

I used to live in Manassas, but I moved to more the more central part of VA. KNow where fredericksburg is?

I used to live in Manassas, but I moved to more the more central part of VA. KNow where fredericksburg is?

yea i know where thats at . your about 1 hr . from me . do i know you ?

lol.. not likely. I am an Fbody guy. Debating on whether to get a cobalt ss or not. My daily driver has 240k miles on it and I love it, but its time to upgrade. I've been playing around with the idea of getting a 00-02 WS6... I dunno...