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My buddy let me drive his 6spd Z28 again the other day! I got on it about a lil over half throttle and its still amazingly powerful! I keep makin my mind up to get a Cobalt SS and then I go and do somethin like this. I wanted to cut some donuts but it was his car so I just asked him to do it and he did. There was tiresmoke EVERYWHERE LOL!! We had the tops off too and you could smell it! I LOVE that smell!

Hey DarricksZ28, do you know if they really did anything between the years of 98 and 02 to boost the hp or did they just claim more, I know it was underrated whatever the case?!?! Also did the SS REALLY have more hp or again was that just another claim?

What do yall think? Im thinkin bout gettin an 02 Camaro SS and getting an 06 Cobalt SS maybe "for my girlfriend". How does that sound??
 

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There weren't any substantial increases in the Z28 power from 98-02. I think it was 305hp in 98 and up to 310 in 2002. The SS always made a bit more power, I think the last 2002 SS cars made 333.

Can't go wrong with an LS1. Those cars rock. :)
 

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Yeah man, the rumble is what gets me! I just love that sound and powerful vibration through the drivetrain!
 

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Yeah, there's nothing quite like a haul-ass V8. I love em.

I got the Cobalt for a couple reasons. The interior is lightyears ahead. As is most of the rest of the car.... I love Camaros, but they're clunky, loud, noisy pieces of crap. :) I just wanted something a little "nicer". But you're right... can't argue with an LS1.

(Had a chance to drive a C6 a little while ago - if you thought the LS1 was great, wait till you try that beast. It literally scared the crap out of me. :) )
 

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Contrary to marketing ploys and popular belief, all LS1 powered cars made viurtually the same amount of power from the factory (barring the existance of statistical anamolies known as "factory freaks" and "slugs"). This includes Corvettes... try convincing a Corvette owner that his car makes the same power as a $20K Z28, and he'll probably get really pissed off and tell you you don't know anything... the only thing is... you would be correct. In fact, due to the Corvettes trans-axle and IRS, there is often more drivetrain loss and the f-bodies will often make MORE horsepower at the rear wheels.

Generally speaking, the 01 and 02 f-bodies tend to be just a bit stronger than their pre-01 counterparts- thanks to the LS6 intake manifold. However, the '00 has the hottest cam (it isn't like any of the stock cams could be considered remotely "hot" though...)

A4 f-bodies can expect to lay down 290-310 rwhp in stock form - varying by production variances, weather, dyno, dyno operator, etc... M6 f-bodies can expect anywhere from about 300 rwhp to 320 rwhp on average... I have seen dyno numbers claiming as high as 325 rwhp bone stock down to the paper filter.

Ram Air? Don't worry about it, it's basically a gimmick. At 100 mph, the increased airflow generates about a 3 HP improvement over stock. Is 3 HP enough to overcome the wind-brake the intake creates at those speeds? Unlikely. Basically, Ram Air can't even get out of its own way. The best function of the Ram Air hoods is to bring cooler air to the intake - they are much more affective at this than they are "ramming" the air into the intake. Z28 vs SS will be a driver's race every time. They have the same engine, and they make the same power (excluding variances). The fastsest f-body ever tested by a magazine was actually a Z28. Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords laid down a heroic 12.8 with it.

In short... you can expect the LS1 motor in 98+ f-bodies to be generating anywhere between 340 horsepower and 360 horsepower at the crank... this goes for all models - Z28, SS, Trans Am, Formula, WS6, and Firehawk.
 

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CoBIZZLE said:
Yeah man, the rumble is what gets me! I just love that sound and powerful vibration through the drivetrain!

You should have bought my car before I sold it!

'02 WS6 in mint condition, M6, t-tops... intake, full exhaust with cats removed, LS1edit dyno tuning.... 345 rwhp and 360 rwtq.

It sold for $16,911
 

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Discussion Starter #7
DanM said:
I love Camaros, but they're clunky, loud, noisy pieces of crap. :)
I wouldnt go so far as to call em crap! LOL They can be rattle traps but they are still awesome cars!

DanM said:
It literally scared the crap out of me. :)
If only I could be so lucky!

VeloSSity said:
Z28 vs SS will be a driver's race every time.
I agree 100%!! I've always said that!! My buddy (with the Z28) was scared (not really scared just thought he was DEFINITELY gonna lose) to race another one of our friend's WS6. Everything else the same LS1, T56, even both had T-tops, pwr windows/locks, everything was the same save for the Make and the fact that the Trans Am had a "ram air" hood on it. I told him he was crazy...

VeloSSity said:
You should have bought my car before I sold it!

'02 WS6 in mint condition, M6, t-tops... intake, full exhaust with cats removed, LS1edit dyno tuning.... 345 rwhp and 360 rwtq.

It sold for $16,911
Man! My dream car is a 2002 Black Camaro SS w/ leather interior, T-tops, T-56, and the SLP package(just cause I like the red SS emblems and most of the SLP package cars -if not all- had those)! But I would have DEFINITELY settled for your car!!! What color was it? Please dont tell me it was black...
 

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CoBIZZLE said:
Man! My dream car is a 2002 Black Camaro SS w/ leather interior, T-tops, T-56, and the SLP package(just cause I like the red SS emblems and most of the SLP package cars -if not all- had those)! But I would have DEFINITELY settled for your car!!! What color was it? Please dont tell me it was black...


The former ride:

 

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Man you're breakin my heart!!! I coulda had that EASY!!! How long ago did ya sell it?!?!
 

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I've had 2 Camaro's and I just never could really like the interior, or how I sat in the car. Both of them Z28's. I actually enjoyed my '87 Z more than the '94. Loved the rumble of the V-8, but loved my Mustang's sound even better. I play on both sides of the domestic field, the 4 cyl and the v-8's and even though I just now got into the turbo 4cyl now I have the internet vette/stang/z28 people telling me I have no idea about v-8's and I am a wannabe. You are living in denial if you don't think a CobaltSS, Srt-4 or a Honda Civic will whoop a V-8 with a good driver. It has to be some sort of pride issue,
 

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mm_omega2 said:
I've had 2 Camaro's and I just never could really like the interior, or how I sat in the car. Both of them Z28's. I actually enjoyed my '87 Z more than the '94. Loved the rumble of the V-8, but loved my Mustang's sound even better. I play on both sides of the domestic field, the 4 cyl and the v-8's and even though I just now got into the turbo 4cyl now I have the internet vette/stang/z28 people telling me I have no idea about v-8's and I am a wannabe. You are living in denial if you don't think a CobaltSS, Srt-4 or a Honda Civic will whoop a V-8 with a good driver. It has to be some sort of pride issue,
I'm sorry but Honda Civic? A civic with ALOT of mods sure that can happen. Do not say civic though. A stock civic is no where near the performance of a Z28 / Trans Am. The two other cars you mentioned need a few mods to stick with them. Sure any car can whoop any car, depends on who's the bad driver.
 

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I love my Camaro and i hate the gas mileage i may not be a V-8 but the 6 still loves to drink that gas. And i have driven a few V-8's but i would love to have a IROC-Z but i just dont think it would be smart for me becuase of all of the driven i have to do. That is why i am converting to a Four cylinder. And i have seen some VERY fast four cylinders out there.
 

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I have witnessed a Geo Storm whoop an '04 Vette at a local track back home, a Dodge caravan tear apart anything that came across it's path, and a Ford Pinto that you would absolutely be an idiot to try and race. (Pinto with a 460 in it, yeah.) People jsut don't like to admit they got beat by a smaller engine.
If you beat a 4cyl with a v-8...what real bragging rights do you have? A 350+HP beat a 240HP neon, your friends would probably laugh at you because you are racing a neon anyway so you have to church it up by saying well it was an SRT-4 with a turbo, but on the other hand....an SRT/SS what have you beating a vette....different story cause then the v-8 guy will be pissed and come back with a ...well you drive a cavalier or a neon B.S. instead of giving props.
People these days have too big an ego for their car and always think it is the fastest on the street.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
mm_omega2 said:
I have witnessed a Geo Storm whoop an '04 Vette at a local track back home
Thats just funny :D

mm_omega2 said:
People these days have too big an ego for their car and always think it is the fastest on the street.
Best statement of his whole argument AND the entire discussion!
 

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mm_omega2 said:
If you beat a 4cyl with a v-8...what real bragging rights do you have?
You have the bragging rights that you won the race.

I'm not going to call you a ricer, or tell you that you don't know anything about V8s, etc... but your logic is seriously flawed.

I thought the whole point of a race was to make it to the finish line quicker. How people somewhere along the line got the idea that nitrous is "cheating", or that a V8 should "pull 4 plugs" to make it even is downright asinine. If I have 4 more cylinders than you, and I have nitrous... then my car is a V8 with nitrous and I'd be a damn idiot not to use the power I have. Run what you brung... excuses are made by the driver of the slower car.

The other thing you are forgetting in a SRT-4 vs. Z28 type comparison is the forced induction the SRT has. The Z28 has 4 more cylinders? Fine. The SRT has a turbo. You do realize that for every 14.7 psi of boost thrown at a motor, the effective displacement and A/F being consumed is doubled, right? That means a 2.5L STi with 12 lbs of boost is operating very similarly to a 5.0L DOHC N/A V8. People rave about the specific power output (HP/L - which is a garbage statistic in the first place), but they don't realize it's practically the same thing. Tell someone you are producing 300 HP with a DOHC 5.0L V8, and you'll hear shit like, "yeah but you got 4 more cylinders", or "that's all the HP you can make with 5.0L??? Shit, I'm making 300 HP out of my turbo 2.5L" ... stupid arguments.......

A couple more things... you said a Cobalt SS or SRT-4 could whip on your 94 Z28 if they were driven properly. That's pretty close to accurate because the 94 Z28 was LT1 powered... if you take on a LS1 Z28 (98+), you wouldn't fare nearly as well, and the driver would have to start making serious errors before the SS or SRT could keep pace. We all know that a Dodge Omni can beat a Ferrari when the universe aligns... but for the sake of an intelligent argument, let's assume grandma isn't driving any of these cars, ok? The discussion was about the CAR, not the driver.

And finally, you menioned a Ford Pinto with a 460, and then went on to say, people hate getting beat by a car with a smaller engine. A 460 is a bigger engine than a Camaro has (346)... so I'm not sure what you were trying to say there...

I am never going to be pissed off if a lose to a car with a smaller motor. The only time I am going to be pissed is if I lose to a slower car... and in that case, I'll only have myself to blame.
 

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The Z28 tends to be quicker in the quarter mile because it's lighter than the SS. The SS has larger sway bars and also the 17" rims that help cornering but hurt overall acceleration. Also the 01-02 models come with the LS6 manifold, where the 98-00 have the regular LS1 manifold with the EGR in the intake path. There is a mod for that. The 98 also has a different PCM. The exhaust manifolds are different. The injectors are smaller, so when nitrous is used a smaller jet is needed with the stock system as not to cause a lean condition. The LS1 is a beast stock, and once the mods start coming. :eek:
 
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