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Couple things, first, unless your car has over 50K miles and a failed cat-con, it is against Federal law to replace it with anything but a factory replacement. (under 50K failure requires GM to replace it for you, same as any emission device).

Second, they are pricey, and if you pick up more than 2 horsepower (stock ones cost you less than 4-6 horses), I will eat a bug.

Fairly expensive horses to buy, probably cost you over $50 for each one.

You would be much better off changing your exhaust system as far as gain vs. cost.
 

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it may be against the federal law but if you live in a state that has no emission tests or standards then what is going to happen? If you don't have a federal agent knocking on your door asking if you removed your cat or changed it then no worries. The only way to get caught like that is if your car got tested, so if your state doesn't test oh well, not like all mechanics or dealerships can tell the difference between a catalytic convertor.
 

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got a point. I am stationed in Minot AFB, ND and we don't have Emissions. Probably cause the of the Winters. I know -50 can't be good for the car.
 

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yeah we've discussed this one before also. I am originally from S.C. no laws at all. I had my '94 Rustang GT, took it to the muffler shop, got all the stock pipes removed from headers back, and replaced w/ 3" pipes and 2 flowmasters. Noone said anything for the rest of the time I had the car.
Even if your state has emissions laws, if you have a brand new car, and as long as it doesn't throw any codes you won't fail an inspection.
 

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Doesn't our car already come with a high flow cat? Isn't it like meant for truck applications? Or am I thinking of something else?
 

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if you can ever get it off take a look at it, hold one end up to the sun and the other end try and look through it. My friends high flow cat you can see sunlight through it, stock one nothing.
 

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Well I am not going to tear out my cat to look at it...lol. Hell I doubt I'll even replace the exhaust in the next 3 years (you know, pack rat style with money...wanna pay off the last 2yrs of payments in one large amount of cash and laugh at saturn..go 0%).
 

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I hear ya there. I've been doubling up on payments and should pay off my 5yr loan in a little over 2. Then, new cars and the srt .....well I will just leave the surprises til later.
but enough about my p.o.s..... go buy a hi-flow cat.
 

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mm_omega2 said:
it may be against the federal law but if you live in a state that has no emission tests or standards then what is going to happen?
Sure, the odds of you being caught in such a State are almost zero, unless they start testing in the future and use a visual test, however some people actually don't like breaking Federal law. Glad to know that a member of our armed forces feels they are above such petty things as laws and rules.

My second reason does not seem practical to you either I guess. You remember? The one about gaining a couple of horsepower for over $100 in cost.

By all means, urge him to swap it out, won't really make any difference in emissions, just against the letter of the law, won't really make any difference in power either. The couple of horses assumes that the cat is the bottle-neck in the exhaust. Probably the muffler chokes it down worse. So, spend the money, get almost zero gain without other exhaust work. Or flush the cash down the toilet and watch it swirl into the sewer, about the same improvement on the car either way.
 

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DigDug said:
Sure, the odds of you being caught in such a State are almost zero, unless they start testing in the future and use a visual test, however some people actually don't like breaking Federal law. Glad to know that a member of our armed forces feels they are above such petty things as laws and rules.
Well it's a good thing I don't have a hi-flow cat on my car, it still has the stocker. Who's that armed forces guy that's above the law?
Any advise to those running stage # kits on their cars since they are all marked as not for use on pollution controlled vehicles, I don't have one of those either.
Hopefully a person would not only change out the cat anyway unless they were doing a header back swap w/ larger pipes and new mufflers then the stocker would be a bottleneck.
People spend alot more money on even less horsepower, a hi-flow cat I have seen was $80 installed. How much does a new intake cost? CAI around $200, SRI $150ish....1-2hp gain.
I don't know why me saying "urging" it is a huge deal, like people were taught in Elementary school(hopefully) if your friend goes and jumps off a cliff are you going to do it too?
 

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mm_omega2 said:
Who's that armed forces guy that's above the law? ?
Well, I assume you are in the military as you list an air force base as your location.

mm_omega2 said:
yeah we've discussed this one before also. I am originally from S.C. no laws at all. I had my '94 Rustang GT, took it to the muffler shop, got all the stock pipes removed from headers back, and replaced w/ 3" pipes and 2 flowmasters.
and, silly me, thought that you writing earlier in the thread about how you pulled the cats off your Mustang meant you actually had done so. I guess you were lying or forgot that you had done so since that earlier post.

As far as you encouraging someone to break the law, well, if you don't like someone who disagrees with you, perhaps you should quit posting in a publically accessable .com

Obviously I have hit a nerve, as you feel the need to defend yourself. Perhaps you should not write things that you might feel defensive about when called on them.
 

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DigDug said:
Well, I assume you are in the military as you list an air force base as your location.



and, silly me, thought that you writing earlier in the thread about how you pulled the cats off your Mustang meant you actually had done so. I guess you were lying or forgot that you had done so since that earlier post.

As far as you encouraging someone to break the law, well, if you don't like someone who disagrees with you, perhaps you should quit posting in a publically accessable .com

Obviously I have hit a nerve, as you feel the need to defend yourself. Perhaps you should not write things that you might feel defensive about when called on them.
I wasn't in the military back when I had my mustang. I was in high school in '94 when I got it back before I knew Federal laws on emissions standards. You haven't hit a nerve yet. Just defending that this armed forces guy, since I joined up, hasn't broken any petty rules and laws.

Manufacturers and required by law to provide emissions control devices, people are required to have one on the car. You are only violating emissions standards if you are pumping out more polution than the legal limit, and the only way for them or you to find out is if they check your car. Most all new model cars are only connected up to a computer which tells if all of your devices are working properly, no CEL codes, and out prints your new inspection sticker. Also practically all new hi-flow cats pass federal EPA and CARB standards. Federal laws only say you have to have the stock cat on up to 50,000 miles after that you can legally put on an aftermarket catalytic converter and then it says review local and state laws, if your state has no emissions laws in place, then by all means put on a hi-flow cat with no worries.
"Federal Law stipulates that a converter isn't supposed to be replaced with an aftermarket unit unless a vehicle has 50,000 miles or is 5 years old. Prior to that, the original equipment converter is covered by the factory warranty. If it fails, the vehicle owner is supposed to take it to the dealer and have it replaced under warranty. The only exception is if the original converter was physically damaged."
 

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I'd be very surprised if the stock cat wasn't a hi flow model. With upgrades in mind, I just don't think GM would skimp here.
Aftermarket cats do flow well, but they are substandard compared to the OEM stuff. That's why they can sell them so cheap.
Here in Oregon, we have emissions tests every 2 years. I have yet to have any of the aftermarket stuff last long enough to pass the second year. Of course, by law, they also have to carry the 50k/5 year warranty, so they will replace them for free. It's a real pian to go through the process though....unless you get them through Jegs or Summit.
I have used both the Dynomax 2.5" and the Magnaflow 2.5" units. The Magnaflow is the better of the two. This is on a quad 4 powered Olds 442 FWIW.
One good thing here in Oregon, on a new car, you get 4 years until it need to go through emissions testing....plenty of time to play.
Ron
 
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